Episode 5 | Mean Girls

Episode 35Listen Here

Julia: Christina. What’s the date today? 

Christina: It’s October 3rd.

Julia: Quit tryna fetch happen. 

Christina: You’re like a really pretty.

Julia: Thank you. 

Christina: So you agree, you think you’re really pretty? 

Julia: Are you ready? Hey friends, this is Pop Culture Makes Me Jealous. And I’m your host, Julia. And on today’s show, Christina Kay is here. And we’re talking about the cultural phenomenon.That is Mean Girls. Mean Girls is a 2004 American teenage comedy film directed by Mark Waters and written by Tina Fey. The film stars, Lindsay Lowen, Rachel McAdams, Tim. Ana Gasteyer Amy Poehler and Fey. It has been said, the movie is based on a book by Rosalind Wiseman, titled Queen Bees and Wannabes, which was published in 2002, which was the year I graduated high school.

Julia: Ouch, which focuses on the ways in which girls from high schools form cliques and on patterns of aggressive teen behavior and how to deal with them before we dive in. Let me reintroduce you to my guest. Christina Kay has been on the show many times in season one and graciously agreed to pop in for season two.

Julia: She is a California based hairstylist and photographer, specializing in boudreaux photos, her philosophy: “Look good feel good” can apply to every day. Christina, welcome back to the show. 

Christina: Julia, I’m pumped to be back and you know why I’m pumped to be back?

Julia: Because. You love me?

Christina: As well, obviously, but also because do you know what day it is?

Julia: It’s October 3rd. 

Christina: It’s October 3rd. He fed so fetch. And then this is what I’ve been waiting for. You said we’re going to be reviewing movies and TV and pop cultures things. And I said, Mean Girls. We’re gonna we do Mean Girls, one day. 

Julia: You’ve been asking for a while and then, and then you were like, but it should probably happen on October 3rd. And I was like, that’s a fan right there. She knows what. 

Christina: Look, it’s all about marketing. Okay. We’re going to do it right. 

Julia: Let’s kick off with a summary that I found on the internet. I literally can’t remember. So I can’t give credit to where I found the summary and I apologize to whoever may have written it.

Julia: I’m not fully plagiarizing. I will totally 100% look into my search history to find where this came from. “Cady Heron is a hit with the plastics, the A list girl, click at her new school until she makes the mistake of falling for Aaron Samuel’s the ex-boyfriend of alpha plastic, Regina George. On April 30th, 2004, Roger ebert.com reviewed Mean Girls and had this to say, “Mean Girls dissects high school society with a lot of observant detail, which seems surprisingly well-informed. The screenplay by Saturday Night Live’s, Tina Fey is both a comic and a sociological achievement. Tina Fey was the first female head writer in SNL history and went on to create and star in 30 Rock, which is a personal favorite of mine. 

Julia: On the same day, the New York Times Ran a review, which observed, “Though narrative cohesion isn’t the strength of Mean Girls which works better from scene to scene than as a whole. The intelligence shines in its understanding of contradictions, keeping a comic distance from the emotional investment of teenagers that defined Ridgemont High and later at the adolescent angst movies of John Hughes. Like Mr. Hughes’s, writing Ms. Faye’s combines, comedic practicality, and a fascination with the cruelty born of suburban privilege. 

Julia: Christina, I know this movie means a lot to you, so let’s just start with, why do we love Mean Girls? 

Christina: Okay. I think I love Mean Girls mainly for the time that it came out was like, It’s going to sound silly, but it was like the perfect time for me, because I was, I just finished. I said, I finished elementary school and was going into middle school, which felt like a big deal. But what was even worse was so like the first week of summer break, my friends called me on a group call and they were at a sleep over I wasn’t invited to. And they told me they didn’t want to be my friend anymore.

Christina: So I spent my very first real summer because in elementary school we didn’t have summer break. We went year round. 

Julia: Gotcha. 

Christina: And middle school is when I got my first like summer break. My first summer break. I spent alone with my mom because I didn’t have friends. So. Scared going into middle school eventually, like we made a, whatever happened, happened, but then like Mean Girls came out and it was like, I had gone through my own like really traumatic, like Mean Girl experience and then to see like a movie where it was like all high school based. And I just was like, felt validated like, oh, it’s okay. Everyone goes through crap, and then you can still come out and be okay at the end. And it was just like, I liked that. I really liked Janice Ian ironically the most, because she was just kind of like a fuck all attitude. And she was just, she wanted to do her own thing always, and she didn’t care what people thought.

Christina: And I just thought that was cool. Like I wasn’t that way, but I really looked up to her in that way. And then of course, yeah. I just thought it was funny movie. 

Julia: I completely identified with the Janis Ian character in the sense of like, nobody understood me. And then having like the one friend, I had a couple friends though, so I can’t say it was one, I was fortunate to have a couple who were like, oh girl, we get you. We’ll be friends with you. 

Christina: Those are a good friends. 

Julia: And they’re still my friends to this day. I was just talking to them yesterday actually. 

Christina: That’s the best. I was lucky enough to have those ones too. 

Julia: Yeah. I think it’s amazing. I was literally like weeks after I found out I was pregnant. This movie released, I was 20 listeners. Give you some context, Christina and I are not the same age. Please don’t think that I was 

Christina: 11 and 20. We were very different. 

Julia: Very different places. And so coming into it as a 20 year old, so like my friend group wasn’t like that. The hierarchy. High school society existed in the way that it did in Can’t Hardly Wait. You had the jocks, you had the preppies, you had the sports PE or jocks or sports people. You had the nerds, you had the kids who were into anime, which apparently is cool now. And then. 

Christina: That flipped the switch real quick. Didn’t it? 

Julia: And so, so to watch this movie, it was kind of like, Is this everybody, but then at the same time, you know, we did have like those preppy girls, those a- A crowd girls that everybody knew about. And like, I dunno if anybody was scared of them, the way that they were, uh, Regina George, like Regina, George is a terrible human. 

Christina: Oh, for sure. Like watching this movie now, like with the lens, a different lens, it’s like. I don’t, it’s hard. It’s hard to like rewatch one of your absolute favorite movies in a different like lens or a grownup lens because. 

Julia: You don’t watch it all the time? I figured you just watched it all the time. 

Christina: I mean, for the most part I do. I, I had it on this morning. But it’s different. Like when I get ready for the podcast, you’re asking me questions, I’m reading articles. Like, you know, like we’re straight up comparing things. 

Julia: I’m forcing you to look at it in a different way.

Christina: You’re making me, you’re making me analyze the things I watch. It’s not always about it. I gotta be honest. Yeah. I mean kind of ruined some of the art enjoy in it, but sorry, but that’s a no, because it’s also, it was a different time. So at that time, and. Capacity mental capacity as an 11 year old, trying to understand things. It was perfect for me. The comedy. 

Julia: Yeah. 

Christina: I mean, it was probably a little advanced, but it was, I was a nineties kid. So like we were allowed to watch racy things like when we were supposed to, you know, like. 

Julia: I love that you just said a racy thing. 

Christina: That’s what my mom would say. I don’t even know what that means. Risque. That’s probably what she meant. 

Julia: Maybe I, this time around, I kind of had some issues cause so it’s one of the ones they never turn off. Like if, if, if I’m flipping through the channels, cause I’m a Relic and still have cable, I will probably never cut the cord. They will have to rip it out of my cold dead hands. I don’t, I like, oh, Mean Girls is on. Okay. I put it on. 

Christina: Yeah. 

Julia: It’s one of those ones that I’m always, if it’s on, I’m going to watch it. If people haven’t seen it and I’m like, okay, we’re going to have a movie night. You know what I mean? Like, it’s not one that I’m never going to watch again. And so watching it in preparation for this one, and we’ll get into this in a little bit later too, because there’s some statements made in another article that we’re going to reference where I was just like, Hmm. I don’t know if I agree with that, with that set. There are some things that I’m just like, Ooh, that’s not going to age.

Julia: Well, that did not age well.

Julia: And one of them is the use of the R word. 

Christina: I caught that one today. 

Julia: Yup. Clocked it three times. And I was like, Ooh, I thought in 2004, we were already not using that word, but maybe I’m wrong. Maybe I was just progressive in 2004 and dropped it out of my vocabulary to this day. I cannot stand it when people use that. It driv- like it’s not okay. 

Christina: It was, it was one of those things where I, I guess probably because I was actively watching it and stuff, just having it on. Like I always do, because like, when you have it on, like, you always do, you just recite it. You’re not, Hey, you’re not absorbing it because you’ve seen it so many times you don’t need to pay attention.

Julia: Correct. 

Christina: But when you’re sitting in. Actually actively watching it now with, you know, where we are in today’s society lens. I was like, Ooh, those some things don’t we can’t say no more. 

Julia: Yeah. 

Christina: That an age. Well, or like things that like, I once probably laughed at that. I’m like, okay, that’s not as funny. Right.

Julia: Right. Tina 

Christina: makes like an uncomfortable thing because it’s like, it’s one of those things where it shows that you’ve grown as a person, you know, but it also is one of those things where if we go back and watch literally anything from before 2020 no offense, but it’s true. Like, yeah, there’s a lot of stuff, a lot of problems. And so it’s like, you almost have to take it with a grain of salt, like in a way, like, okay, we’re going to find problems. All of these or are we going to sit here and pick out everything that’s bad? Or can we focus on some of the like, okay, this is what they were trying to do. Yeah. 

Julia: Yes. And I think when you become Canon in the way that Mean Girls has become cannon. It is still a problem. 

Christina: Yes. 

Julia: Cause like in to that, like I said, in 2004, I had removed it from my vocabulary. So I assumed in my tiny ass town of Modesto, that that was normal. But apparently it’s not because you have a New York based writer chucking in in there three times. 

Christina: I think too, there was a, I mean, a couple of different stuff that. You know, like when, when Janice is Janice Ian’s line about, um, Damian being too gay to function. And then later on when she goes, it’s only okay when I say that, that line specifically, “it’s only okay when I say that”, I feel like sums up the like early two thousands to mid two thousands. When I guess everyone was starting to realize like, Hey, maybe we shouldn’t make these jokes, but we still try to pass them off as jokes. So what we did was go only, I’m allowed to say that because I’m their friend and I’ve heard all that. You know the hurt first to me. 

Julia: Yeah. It’s like, you can’t talk shit about my mom, but I can talk shit about my mom. 

Christina: Yes. I feel like that’s right before we’re getting to the now time, like where everyone’s really aware of what they’re saying. That’s kind of what we would do like that. I would say what the progressive slowly jump was, right there is a yearning those like, that’s how you called it out was a joke. Like you call out people in a joke because that’s how it was okay to be progressive. 

Julia: It’s not intense. It’s not uncomfortable. You’re like laughing about it. I get you. I understand. 

Christina: I’m not trying to say like it’s, it’s okay to just appease whatever happened. Then what I’m saying is. You have to realize that at that time that was being progressive was calling it out and someone else calling it out in a joke going like not okay. And yeah, I feel like a lot of the movies, cause I’ve been watching, like, I don’t know, Amazon Prime’s had a lot of like 2000 early, 2000 hit movies on there. So matching the early one. Cringe city. Why did I like, how did we feel like this female male dynamic in movies? I’m like, I can’t handle this. 

Julia: Listen. 

Christina: This man’s irritating so much.

Julia: So many things are just not okay. And there’s so many reasons why as older millennials are a hella fucked up. Pop culture is one of those reasons. 

Christina: For sure, because we’ve literally witnessed the switch to on the screens. It’s like all the stuff that we used to enjoy. We’re no longer enjoying it. Yeah. Now my nostalgia is not fun. 

Julia: Right. 

Christina: How dare you. Right. 

Julia: Maybe Regina George was saying that was the, maybe that was Tina Fey’s commentary on the statement. Cause Regina, George is an awful person and she’s literally the only character who’s using it. So maybe that was part, maybe that was her having, that was her commentary. Like this is a terrible person using this term. But no one else in the movie is using it. Yeah. I don’t know. Tina Fey’s done stuff. That’s really funny. And then like, it doesn’t always land well, so it’s just kind of one of those things where just like.

Christina: I think this is comedians in general are comedy writers, they do that where like they really push the envelope and it might be coming from a good place in their heart, but it doesn’t come across for the audience as that. Whatever they were going for. And it’s already. 

Julia: It’s only for a very specific audience and it leaves out a population of people because her whole cake message on SNL, she came back and like was eating a cake and had this whole monologue. It was funny. But then when you kind of get more into it, the Black community had a hard time. Black women had a hard time with that speech. And there, I think that they’re completely justified in that, but that is a digression. And for those of you listening, if you want to learn more, go and Google. I don’t know.

Julia: I don’t know if that’s what you should Google, but that’s what I would Google look. 

Christina: A lot of things might pop up. 

Julia: Be careful, be careful.

Christina: Be careful where you Google that, where you Google that.

Julia: The Guardian ran an article in 2018 with the headline, Fetch happens. Why Mean Girls is the Perfect Teen Movie” and they had this to say, “At the beginning of the film, Cady who was previously homeschooled in Africa is presented with the cafeteria strict social hierarchy, 

Christina: I think you mean Cady I’m sorry. 

Julia: It’s okay. Cause it’s the beginning of the movie. So she is Cady she’s not in Cady yet. 

Christina: Yeah. 

Julia: I’m going to continue. Yeah. 

Christina: I’m sorry. I had to make the joke. 

Julia: I think I’m here for it. “Varsity jocks, unfriendly Black hotties, girls who eat their feelings, girls who don’t eat anything, and the plastics, the coolest girls in school. It plays into that feeling everyone has at school that they’re either that they either are cool or that they wish they could be. But soon after you leave school, you realize. Everyone’s sucked. Their clothes, their affections, their terrible taste in music. The belief that you and your friends are the first people to do anything you’re doing it doesn’t make any difference whether you were popular or not. School kids are probably the lamest demographic ever.” The Guardian’s hypothesis of this movie being the perfect team movie is supported by this statement, “The journey, Cady [because now she’s Cady because she’s been on her journey] goes on, is not transforming. She doesn’t end up cooler than she was rather it’s a realization that everyone sucks the same. The writer goes on to say that this movie has the perfect ending with Regina, George becoming a lacrosse player, janice Ian coupling up with Kevin G and Cady Heron didn’t just find her place. She’s realized the entire regimented structure of high school doesn’t matter. And what is coming of age, if not the realization that everything you thought mattered six months ago is actually nonsense.” 

Julia: So do we agree? Is this the perfect team movie? I already know my answer. 

Christina: Tell me yours first. 

Julia: No, it’s not. I don’t think it is. 

Christina: I don’t think it is either, but I’m still like proceed. Why? 

Julia: Tell you why? I guess that sense. I find that when you have a film that centers around this concept, that there is, um, high school hierarchy. And while I do appreciate the way that Tina Fey highlights the hierarchy and calls it out and sort of mocks it, that wasn’t my high school experience. So I think a perfect teen movie represents a majority of high school experience. And I don’t know if this is, is this majority high school experience. I know you shared that story earlier, Two, I think a perfect team movie is going to age well, like we just watched, and this is my bias because again, I was 14 in 19 99, 10 Things I Hate About You.

Christina: Yeah, 

Julia: Can’t Hardly Wait. I was a little worried, showed it to my teen. It was a little worried, actually kind of holds up a little bit. There’s some, there’s some like gross stuff, but for the most part, we didn’t have a it kind of maybe, and now I missed, maybe I’m miss remembering. And now I’m panicking a little bit about saying it holds up.

Christina: You’re fine. 

Julia: Then 100% and 10 Things I Hate About You. To this day, 22 years later. It’s also based on a Shakespeare play. So maybe that’s why, but don’t get me started on Shakespeare. Your turn. Go ahead. 

Christina: I, I would agree that it’s not the perfect teen movie because it is not at all. I don’t think most high schools are like that. I don’t think, I mean, our high school definitely had cliques I’m not going to say that it didn’t, but I would say a lot of our like, quote cliques intermingled within other like clicks. Like you might have to 

Julia: Jock parties all the time until it. Why should I can’t tell you why.

Christina: I don’t. Yeah, I don’t think like, I think it was a little bit too intense on the clique part, but I don’t know if that was just part of it. The dramatics of, uh, like, uh, movies, you know, like movies in general tend to heighten things. So it’s like, yeah, in general you can go to a high school and see cliques but they’re not that like intense. Yeah. At the same time, like I did appreciate how, when they, at the end of the movie and they show like everyone in their next year, it shows them all, basically. Changed, but not different people. If that makes any sense.

Julia: They were able to find their avenue that worked better for them. 

Christina: Definitely. But I also think that that’s just like a really good that right there showed More about high school than anything was the fact that you can have one whole insane year and the next year you’ll come back and it can be a very different experience because I think all four years of high school, you are changing. You’re changing a ton and not much at all. You, you find new things constantly that you want to get interested in or new people or.

Julia: Tap into shit that you don’t really know if you’re into that. You just trying it on for size to see if it fits. 

Christina: Yeah. You’re like, well, those people are doing it and that looks fun. So like, I’ll try it out. Like it’s a lot of trial and error in high school. So I think it did show that a lot. But, yeah, I don’t think.

Julia: It’s just so clique-ish, it’s so hierarcy. 

Christina: I don’t think it’d be the perfect teen movie. I would say it’s like, if you want to put it in like a perfect category, like it’s just like a perfect, like catch all movie for, I would say specifically girls, like more showcases. The range of different girls, you’re going to come across in your life. 

Julia: Where was she first meets Cady Cady first meets the plastics and Regina it’s like, oh, I love your bracelet. And she’s like, oh, thank you. It’s whatever. And then fast forward 45 minutes. And Regina is like, oh, I love your skirt to that girl. And she’s like, thanks my mom. And Regina’s like, Ooh, vintage. And then she’s like, that’s the ugliest, effing skirt I’ve ever seen. 

Christina: Yep. That’s like, It. And you see Cady. 

Julia: We’ve all been in that situation. 

Christina: Yeah. Learn like that’s how you learn in high school about people. And that’s how you learn about like social cues. Like I’m convinced that teenagers are just like second phase toddlers. They’re learning by modeling all of them, the things adults do, but they still need a bunch of guidance and help, which is basically what toddler developed yet. That’s what toddlers do out of babyhood before they’re like, Yeah, that’s what I think teens are.

Julia: I agree to an extent. I have met some children in, in, in my child’s career school career where I’m like, that’s a sociopath. And my, my mother who’s a therapist will say, they’re, they’re not, no, because they’re still only 10. We can’t call them that. And I’m like, you know, give it time. But for the most part, I do think that we’re, you know, as teenagers, we’re all still trying to figure out who we are and where we fall and where we fit. And then when we don’t have the freedom to do that, then we kind of can get potentially boxed into shit that doesn’t fit for us. And then we’re just miserable the rest of our lives. 

Christina: That happens very often, but that’s enough tropes in movies. How many times have you heard? I want to live my life. Dad, not yours. We’re always just teaching the same lessons. Stop control your kids. 

Julia: Listen being obsessed with movies and television forever. And now I’m in the phase of life where I’m the parent and this whole parents just don’t understand shit. I’m just like, haven’t we evolved past that. I’m pretty sure millennials kind of. Moved a little bit forward in the sense. My son is shaking my head no. But I, I, you know, like some of this stuff that comes out, I don’t know. 

Christina: I maybe not, but I will say like.

Julia: Not to sound like Amy Poehler right now. Yeah. I’m actually a cool actual mom. 

Christina: And that I believe you, I believe. For sure. I’m just saying like, like, like he’s going to, it might take him 10 years, but he’s going to go back and go. Yeah. My mom was coolest at this time. He can’t admit it. 

Julia: He know he does sometimes 

Christina: he won’t on camera right now because he wants him to do that. 

Julia: I’m not going to, but he has told me he’s like, especially when he got into high school, he was like, mom, you know what I realized? I was like, what? And he’s like, you’re actually kind of cool. It’s like, yeah. Cause you made friends with people whose parents fucking suck. 

Christina: That doesn’t help. 

Julia: And then, and then he’ll tell me stuff about his friends. I’m just like, ah, well, if you guys ever want to hang out at the house, just let me know. And now it’s like only people who are vaccinated are allowed

Christina: Boundaries are good, as long as you do in which you need.

Julia: Okay. I mean, you know, I’m very paranoid about communicable diseases in general. So I feel like whenever people give me shit, I’m just like, remember what I do for a hobby. Have you told him? Yeah, I follow STD statistics. So why wouldn’t you think I’m panicking about something that you could breathe on me to give me the other way. You have to stick something in me to give it to me. 

Christina: How many people are you letting breathe on you? 

Julia: Never none. 

Christina: Cause I’m just, I’m not, I’m not quite on your end of the spectrum, but no one’s getting near me enough to do any of this. 

Julia: I’m overwhelmed. I admit I’m overwhelmingly paranoid about proximity to people prior to the pandemic. Like that’s always been true. My dear friend, Sarah, like you’ve known me long enough and my dear friend, Sarah can corroborate as well. If we need references, if you need more references, than Christina do that. 

Christina: Live you’re paranoid life I do.

Julia: I actually do live a pretty decent life for being as fucking paranoid as I am about. I mean also cause YOLO I know nobody says that. I know that’s not cool to say it. 

Christina: Like how you just got done on a ramp being a cool mom. And then you went straight in to how paranoid you are and then saying, tell me again how cool you are. 

Julia: Yeah. I mean, there’s a reason why we need therapy in this house. I’m actually chalking it up now because to the fact that I haven’t had the opportunity to learn who I am, not in the community that I lived, if that makes sense. Like, you know, when you like Mo when people move away, they like are in a different environment. So they get to learn more about themselves that they maybe didn’t get to learn here. Cause here in your hometown, you have people telling you who you are and what you should be when you move away. That doesn’t happen right away necessarily. I like in the instance with Cady Heron, she’s. Her world in Africa was so different. The tight, like this culture of high school, she didn’t even have primary school to prepare her.

Julia: Right? And so in the very beginning of the movie, she’s very sweet and innocent and 100% gun-ho about the Mathletes you know, and then every, and then everybody in everybody’s don’t join. 

Christina: Same in every country. 

Julia: But then everyone’s like, don’t join them mathletes like Janice. 

Christina: Social suicide. 

Julia: It’s socially. They all say the same thing. Don’t join the mathletes as social suicide. 

Christina: Didn’t say anything. She didn’t. It was Damien Damien. 

Julia: Okay. 

Christina: Yeah. Janice is to give two shits as long as she was there at her art show and she couldn’t do that. 

Julia: Couldn’t even do that. Cause she went rogue. That’s what happened. Sure. Create a monster.

Christina: Cady Harris Mean Girl.

Christina: Oh, it’s Cady yeah. I’m going to call you Cady.

Julia: You know, that just went on and was on a couple of episodes of the New Girl. 

Christina: Yeah. Yeah. 

Julia: She was the attorney that dated Nick why was that so hard to remember? 

Christina: You scared me, you looked over like you were looking at your son and then you looked at me panicked and I’m like, what’s wrong?

Julia: No, he’s taking a bath. He’s soaking his body. He recently discovered the gym. So, you know, Driving all over fucking town between work and getting them to the gym and to school. It’s like nothing’s near each other. Hate driving short distances. 

Julia: As I mentioned earlier, Mean Girls is a cultural phenomenon with the peop with people quoting, “Stop trying to make fetch happen” or celebrating October 3rd or my personal favorite “on Wednesdays, we wear pink” resulting in people, literally everywhere wearing pink on Wednesdays. The hashtag on Instagram alone has hundreds of thousands of posts attached.

Julia: 15 years after mean girls hit the big screen. Hello Giggles contributor, Janelle Levy gave us this reflection, “…but prior to Mean Girls, a lot of teen movies relied on the idea that teen girl villains and teen girl characters in general are vapid and solely concerned with superficial things. The genius of Mean Girls lies not only in how it addresses larger social issues, but for its unwavering stance that teen girls are hyper aware of the gender norms and cultural pressures informing their worlds.” Is the social hierarchy of high school hierarchy just practice for the real world and is mean girls giving us the tools we need to break this structure down. 

Christina: Sometimes you asked me such fancy questions. It takes me a minute. Sorry. 

Julia: Don’t apologize. Kept because I love what she had to say. The genius of Mean Girls lies not only in how it addresses larger social issues, but for its unwavering stance that teen girls are hyper aware of the gender norms and cultural pressures informing the world. Holy shit. Nailed it. 

Christina: Yeah. 

Julia: Like, yeah, we knew, I don’t know any woman who didn’t know. Where they fit and how they were supposed to make them smells selves either small or invisible or my personal favorite, which I fucking hate policing us for what we wear, because apparently men can’t control themselves. If I wear a tank top. To.

Christina: Shoulders are dangerous. 

Julia: Shoulders are so dangerous. 

Christina: Like lately collarbones don’t even get me started on the sexual appeal of a collarbone. 

Julia: So I actually once was commented on how beautiful my collarbones were. This was also like 20 years ago. So it was a little. 

Christina: It was this when we complimented women based on how thin they were.

Julia: Yeah. Yeah. Cause, cause they were talking 2002 and we’re, you know, Low-rise jeans were it. And you could only wear a low-rise jeans if you didn’t have hips and an ass. And so that was a really hard phase of life, right? 

Christina: Yeah. Same didn’t work out for me. Well, anyone that tries to bring back low-rise jeans can walk right back out my door and not invited here.

Julia: Yeah. Just cruel. Excuse me. Excuse me. Ma’am excuse me, sir. Have you seen the size of mine? That’s not going to, that’s not going to work because. 

Christina: Low-rise jeans weren’t even cute on people like that they were made for like, there’s no time where you want a borderline see someone’s crotch. Like, are we going to see it? If they bend over or stretch up or something. 

Julia: Top of my booty is not for you to see or my thong. 

Christina: You don’t need to see my underwear. Exactly. Remember the whale strap that used to be. 

Julia: That was so popular. And I fucking hated every I’ve said this before. Say it again, I’m a die on this hill. The early aughts were a terrible time for fashion. I want a fucking redo. 

Christina: If you just can go back and look at the people on the red carpet, even they look like they were not having a good time. We got, um, Canadian tuxedos up the ying yang. 

Julia: Oh my God. 

Christina: Layers. So many layers. Like why did we need four tank tops? And they got progressively longer. 

Julia: Yeah.

Christina: All of the, everything was long, like long jewelry.

Julia: Yeah. 

Christina: Goodness gracious. 

Julia: Lacy bottom of the tank tops for a little flair so that every. 

Christina: And then you’d wash it and dry at once and they’d get ruined on something or, oh God. Or I remember distinctly once wearing a black t-shirt and then having a silver Lacey glitter tank top over. And then my long necklaces, because that at one point wearing a tank top over a t-shirt was a look.

Julia: Yes. Yes. It was. 

Christina: And the random ties. Why did we wear a tie?

Julia: I don’t know, I guess .

Christina: Skinny ties.

Julia: I’m telling you it was a cruel, cruel time for fashion. And now I need you to answer my question. I think it did. I think it does.

Christina: I think, yes. Sorry. I thought we answered that. I do think that. 

Julia: Just let us down a rant of fashion. Like why do I keep agreeing to come on this show? Really? Julia just gets distracted. 

Christina: It’s fun for my ADHD. Cause um, I go with it and then I’m like, wait, oh, hold on. We had a process. We got to get back real. 

Julia: It, it just doesn’t help that I’m having a vodka spritzer. 

Christina: Well, I’ll cheers to that with my water. 

Julia: Yeah.

Christina: I think it’s true. I think in high school or high school age girls, that’s when you get the bulk of your. No, I’m going to call it unsolicited programming. 

Julia: Yeah. I liked that. And not that I support it, but I liked the way you, I liked the way you phrased it, because there’s a lot of stuff that I cut you off. I’m sorry. 

Christina: No, I it’s just a lot of stuff, either like movies or pop culture or what you see on the TV of like just the women that you’re going to be turning into right after high school do, like, you’re getting a lot of false, like energy thinking that you need to be this way or look this way or act this way, or you need to fit into this bubble or this bubble, or you’re not allowed to expand your horizons from this group or this group. Like, I think. Teen girls notice that in high school and they start adapting in, like you said, either shrinking or molding themselves to fit where they think that they will do the best or what’s even more sad where they think they’re going to out shine everyone else the best. And I hope that like with gen Z, like times are changing.

Christina: Like now we’re showcasing how everyone’s differences make them better versus how like one person can be. We kind of had like a totality, like a totalitarian, like vibe going on with like high school movies where it’s like, one person was the end, all be all of like popularity and it’s like, I’ve never, I’ve never experienced that in school.

Christina: I guess there every once in a while you would think somebody who was super popular in class, but then you can ask someone else and they would think somebody else was the popular one. 

Julia: When I went to my 10 year high school reunion, I honestly like I had a strong friend group in high school and some of the guys still all hanging out. Well, I don’t know if they still all hang out, but I know that we’re all connected. Like everyone’s still kind of connected in a similar way and because I never left Modesto, there are people I went to high school with who literally have no idea who the other person I still talk to from high school is because they’ve done so much in their life that they’re like, oh, that was 20 years ago. I don’t remember that person, but they’re still very important. Like both of these people are still very important to me, but. One of them remembers who the other is. 

Julia: Because of that. When I went to my, and I just, you know, I thought, oh, I hung out with like a normal group. Like we hung out in the D wing and we were just, you know, different people. We listened to punk, rock music, whatever, go to my high school and this girl comes up to me. She married somebody, we went to high school with she also, we all went to high school together. Her husband’s a grade ahead of us, which I always think is really funny because I don’t think they dated in high school. It doesn’t matter. I’m standing awkwardly in the bar with my drink. I just finished talking to somebody and she walks up to me and she’s like, I just have to tell you, you were so beautiful in high school. Girl, I wore men’s Dickies. We called them wife beaters at the time. Don’t call them that. Now they’re A shirts from Hanes.

Julia: You know, we ha we, we did crazy ass shit to our hair. Junior year is when I tweezed my eyebrows so skinny that they’re still recovering. Like there’s part of them that still won’t fill in even no matter how long I don’t we use or groom. And she just was gushing. And I’m over here. Like how could you even tell, like, remember when my hair, when, remember when I shaved my head, remember when I bleached my hair.

Julia: So blonde, it was like rubber bands on my head. Like, whoa, whoa. Style wasn’t like of the era. Like we went through a punk phase and then, um, Stacy and I went through like this rockabilly phase. She was just gushing and I’m trying, I’m sitting there. I’m like, I remember her, but I have to work really hard to remember her.

Julia: Cause we weren’t in the same group. And then, and I had worn this beautiful green dress. It was like a Kelly Green and it, and it was very tan because I was swimming a lot that summer because swimming make, keeps my mental health going. And that’s probably why I’m where I’m at in life right now. Um, cause I haven’t done something and I mean, I looked good.

Julia: I was fit. I was like, I looked hot, like, oh my God, the Julia and high school would not have recognized this woman. She walked in being, and, and you’re so beautiful now. And I just thought you were so cool and just, gush gush gush and I’m like, why is that happening? 

Christina: Isn’t it it’s so weird. Nothing weirds me out more than when people remember me. And I don’t know who they are. So. 

Julia: 90% of the high school, I went like nine people, like 90% of my high school. I.. 

Christina: Then I also call people that don’t know me. Like there’s people. I definitely remember like very distinctly, but they could. I bet if I saw them on the street, they would know two birds to the wind who I was like, just look at me and see nothing.

Christina: But then at the same time, like one of the girls, I just did like, Hey, when you’re 

Julia: seeing nothing? They’d look at you and be like, who’s that beautiful woman. 

Christina: But I’m saying like, they wouldn’t recognize me from high school. Like, oh, that’s, you know, like they wouldn’t know me, but there’s the one of the girls I just did pictures for she came over and she’s like, yeah, I remember you at a high school. You had like the prettiest, like curls all the time. And. You went to my high school

Christina: and she’s like, yeah, it was a grade under you. I always hung out with like this person, this person she’s like, I always saw you. And I thought you were so pretty. And I’m like, thank you. But like, you know, people know like, you know, that’s like, so that’s why it’s like funny, like. Taylor. And I, we went to high school together.

Christina: Did we date in high school? No, but all the time we’ll be like, do you remember this person who like, know like what we went to high school with them and then he’ll do the same thing to me. He be like, Hey, you know that person? And I’ll be cool. It’s like there was in our grade. No, nothing. 

Julia: Have you had a high school reunion yet?

Christina: No, it should have been this year. I didn’t hear anything about it. 

Julia: You know what? I would love to see Mean Girls high school reunion. 

Christina: Oh, my God did it. I want to say like a couple months ago, Rachel McAdams and like Tina Fey and like one other cast member had agreed. Like they would, there was an article where they had asked, like if there was going to be another one, like, would they want the same cast?

Christina: And Rachel McAdams said she would love to reprise her role as Rachel, as Regina, George. Cause that gets some suburban moms in this. 

Julia: Yes, because think about it in 2024, it’ll be 20 years since Mean Girls released so high “Mean Girls 20 Year High School Reunion,” like who wouldn’t want to know what happened to Regina George 20 years lady later, or Cady Heron. Is Janice and a famous artists now? What happened now? 

Christina: I mean, he is in real life, so life 

Julia: And I fucking love him. Do you follow him on Instagram? 

Christina: Best Jonathan? I don’t know his last name. Jonathan something Bennett, Jonathan, something. I think anybody. No, that’s Lisa we’ll Google. Well, we’ll ask the, IMDB Samuel, 

Julia: Aaron. He was so dreamy and my pregnant ass had a fucking and crush on him.

Christina: Uh, the music that plays when he turns around.

Julia: And he’s just such a good guy.

Christina: He’s not, I think they’re heading into the projection room above the mandatory

Julia: Listen. 

Christina: Taylor Zimmerman for you and Coco

Christina: Glencoe. And generators. Can we have a Caddy Heron and in here it’s pronounced like Katie. Oh yeah. Whatever. And then for Gretchen wieners bye. 

Julia: Who is that from? 

Christina: Thanks for being such a great friend. Love Regina. Uh, and then her rant. Oh, my friend used to be able to do the whole monologue, the Caesar Caesar. Totally. Just totally loved Brutis just as much as they love Caesar. And when does it become okay. For one person to be the boss of everybody? That’s not what Rome’s about

Christina: haters had cracked. 

Julia: Hey friends. Have you watched Mean Girls yet? Cause otherwise. 

Christina: We have all the most important lines already said yes. Yes, it should be. You go back to middle school. If we could bake a cake full of rainbows butter.

Christina: Do you even go to this school? I just have a lot of feelings. That’s a mood. Me and you both girl. 

Julia: Same babe. Same. Can I get out? I know I am sad. The October 3rd is a Sunday because a couple of years ago it was on a Wednesday and it was just like, oh my God, the Mecca. The coming is happening. 

Christina: I have a story for you before we go.

Julia: Okay. 

Christina: So I used to have a shirt that said whatever, I’m getting cheese fries. 

Julia: Yes. That’s such a great scene. I’m only trying to eat things that have 40%, whatever, whatever I’m getting carbs or something, whatever. I’m getting cheese, 

Christina: butter, a carb?

Christina: So I had a shirt that said whatever, I’m getting cheese fries. And I was in my like college earth science class and I was wearing it. And we had just got out of like lab for the day. And I had like a really cool teacher. He was like, he was always really interactive with the students. He would always call us out by name.

Christina: So it wasn’t weird. However, at the very end of class, she was Christina in a mall. And he’s like your shirt’s awesome. Which made everyone, everyone turned around and looked at me. He’s like, I also love cheese fries. He didn’t get the reference. He just thought I was wearing a shirt that said whatever, I’m getting cheese fries.

Christina: Like, that’s all I need in my life, which I would wear a shirt like that for sure. But everyone looked at me and the 19 year old Christina could not handle that kind of like attention. And it was the most like horrifying thing. And I was just like, stop looking at me. It was like afternoon. Like it was hot in the class. So now I’m extra sweaty. 

Julia: Nobody wants that. 

Christina: Nobody wants that. I mean, I love him for liking the shirt, but it was just the most awkward.

Julia: But it proves though that like, there’s this reach too, right? Like, we’ve talked, I wasn’t used to talking about this before, you know, there’s stuff that people put on t-shirts that people are like, okay. Right. Like shopping is my cardio. My understanding, because I’ve seen that episode, a bajillion times originated on Sex in the City, but like, do people know that no, they just need, it’s funny. They just think it’s funny and they post about it because maybe they shop a lot and it’s their cardio, right?

Julia: Like it’s, and so it’s like the same thing, whatever. I’m getting cheese fries, if you know, you know, but if you don’t know about those cheese fries, hey get’m from that place cheese fries good. 

Christina: Dang cheese fries sound so good right now. 

Julia: I can’t afford to send you money to get cheese fries. 

Christina: No, I had In N Out for dinner.

Julia: I’m like so jealous. 

Christina: We’ve been talking about it for, I’m not kidding you for like a month. It’s been like, you want to go to in and out. But every time we pass by the line, 

Julia: the line wicked long. 

Christina: Stupid, it’s not even like worth it. You’re like we will be sitting there. 

Julia: No, they move pretty quick. 

Christina: It’s impeding traffic, like the times. They do, but 

Julia: I’ve done it. I’ve been in that line, but they move quick, 

Christina: but we haven’t done it yet 

Julia: of what the In N Out is apparently where it’s at for high school kids in this town to hang out. 

Christina: I believe that. 

Julia: Did you guys hang out spot? 

Christina: Um, I remember going in and out like three times a week in high school, I would eat dinner before we went home and had dinner. That was my pre-dinner 

Julia: so far away when I was in high school. Cause half the shit that’s developed now didn’t exist. So you literally, Pelandale did not go all the way through like it does now. Like it stopped at Dale also. That was super inconvenient. Yes. Super inconvenient to get to it from like Beyer because you had to go like up and around or down and around because Pelandale didn’t go all the way through.

Julia: And so like when I dropped my child off there after something, I dunno some high school shit it’s packed with high school kids. So I texted my two best friends from high school and I was like, you guys In N Out’s where all the kids hang out now. And they’re like, what? And I was like, yeah, like, I mean, I felt like we didn’t have a lot of shit growing up, but at least we had fucking Nine Two Seven, which is a whole other conversation and Tee’s and Greens which is a whole, whole other conversation.

Julia: But I, and like we had, like, it wasn’t like a ton of kid friendly stuff. Our parents only knew what happened at tees and greens. It’s still like, we weren’t hopping in the car to go cruise In N Out.

Christina: Right after high school. When I was working at Hollister at the mall. 

Julia: Well, it’s right there 

Christina: In N Out and out in and out was the closers after spot, because nothing was open at like 11 or midnight. None of us were, or not, everybody was old enough to go out to drink. Most of us were still 19 or 20, like or 18, even. Like, we weren’t quite old enough to drink, but we were out of high school. So we’re in the awkward, weird, awkward in between. And yeah.

Christina: And like, what are you going to do at 11:00 PM on like a Thursday or Friday? It was like, You all are also on the same schedule as me of going to bed super late. So let’s go to in and out. And so you would go to in and out and that’s where like, yeah, that was the hangout spot. So like I get that, it kind of turned into like a high school spot.

Christina: Cause definitely like in 20 years old we were doing it. 

Julia: News to me. 

Christina: But I also, I also lived in like, I lived in Salida. So for me, the Pelandale In N Out was that was this close as Taco Bell for me. I was like, yeah, you want McDonald’s? Heck no, we’re going to go across the way for In N Out like 

Julia: it was a hike. And now it’s like, just hop on Pelendale real quick and get there real fast. Yeah. The shit is that, why do I still live here? 

Christina: How is it that I can see, like I had In N Out for dinner. I still am. Like, the more we talk about it. I could have another double double right now. 

Julia: Fuck. Yeah, because that shit’s hella good. I’m always like I get an animal. With raw onion. You want both onion? Yeah. Did I stutter? I did not set her animal style with raw onion, no tomatoes. 

Christina: Anyone who’s out when a state listening to this, this is getting so annoyed by this conversation. 

Julia: Shut the fuck up about In N Out and 

Christina: Or like In N Out is not that good. It’s all about insert lame burger place. 

Julia: Five guys, Hardy’s. 

Christina: As people in Texas hella I noticed people like all of their stocks 

Julia: There’s In N Out in Texas. 

Christina: In Dallas I passed by it. Yeah. 

Julia: They go as far as Texas, there’s one just, just north of the Oregon border. I remember when they went up, I remember 

Christina: they went Colorado.

Julia: I remember when they finally went like hella in Northern California for the first time, like ever. And like, it was a big deal. I’m not that old. Like, I really should remember this shit, like. 

Christina: But we just need to establish that In N Out is very popular. So the fact it’s like, it’s very popular for California specific. So the fact that it’s expanding out is a big deal 

Julia: because it was a So Cal thing for the longest time. Like when we got our In N Out it was a big deal because, oh my God, they’re finally like this far north Modesto is like, not that far north, but, um, when I was in Arizona for my. Hmm, friend from high school and I was in her wedding.

Julia: I got so drunk at her reception. The next day we went and got In N Out and I was like, oh, I just love that you’ve live near an In N Out and we’re in Arizona right now. 

Christina: There’s every time my cousin comes in from Louisiana, the first stop we made is that In N Out it doesn’t matter what time she comes in. Most of the time she’ll take the latest flights. It’s like 11 or 12 that we’re driving home and it’s like, it doesn’t matter. I don’t care if I’ve been awake all day. I don’t care if it’s a two hour time change, give me my in and out. She’d be like sleeping and still like, try and be part of the deal.

Julia: Anyway. Well, as I said, I was 20 and pregnant when Mean Girls released and I spent a good portion of 2004 in the movie theater crying because 1. Emotions and 2. 20 pregnant and alone, that’s not exactly ideal, especially since all my friends had moved in life. And I was just pretty much jealous all the time.

Julia: But what Mean Girls did do was remind me that I was lucky to have a solid girl group of friends that I still talk to today, Christina. Do you have any final thoughts on the actual topic of Mean Girls? 

Christina: Now just thinking about In N Out. No, I think I got all my quotes out. Okay. For now. I’m sure. I’ll think I’m going to think of sounder Janice Ian and. 

Julia: Oh yeah you said that. 

Christina: It’s just the best. I mean, I can’t, you can’t get mad at the fact that Cady Heron, her names. It’s so funny. 

Julia: Lindsay Lohan was the early two thousands darling. 

Christina: She was she, I mean from Parent Trap on, she really nailed it. 

Julia: Parent Trap 1995. That’s not true. 98. I don’t know why the 95 was the 

Christina: You said it confidently though.

Julia: Say it with authority and people will believe you. 

Christina: And then you turned around and told yourself no, you’re wrong. 

Julia: Right. I was thinking because she was 11 in the film. And I remember thinking when I was 11, I wasn’t 11, when it came out, I do love that she’s a redhead playing the in Parent Trap because in their original Maureen O’Hara is plays the mom and she’s a redhead. So I thought that was kind of like, I don’t know if that was on purpose, but I thought it was cute. 

Christina: I didn’t know that. 

Julia: All right, Christina, listen, we kind of get some stuff done and then we don’t like, here’s the topic. And then we just derail. 

Christina: We’re really good at that. Aren’t we get at that. 

Julia: So, you know, that’s okay. Because some of the other episodes this season are going to get real intense. So enjoy this fluff and stuff now listenrs. 

Christina: The fluff and stuff. Enjoy the nice silly stuff for now, before it gets. 

Julia: I just feel like it’s always fun when you stop by. So

Christina: it’s a good time. 

Julia: It is a good time for good, for good. 

Christina: We’re not going to go there. We need to keep you can’t keep painting. It’s nighttime.

Julia: I know everyone where they can find you. If they want to keep up with you online.

Christina: You can follow me at Christina underscore K underscore creations. 

Julia: That’s the letter. 

Christina: It’s K a Y. 

Julia: K A Y. So Christina underscore K a Y underscore 

Christina: creations. Thank you for clarifying that. I always forget. My middle name is not just a letter letter. 

Julia: It’s the okay. Without the, o yeah. But so many people just do. OK, okay. And don’t do O K a Y were some just like how old are we anyway, as always, you can find us in between episodes on Instagram. At pop culture makes me jealous. And while you’re at it, go ahead and subscribe to the show, like it and leave a review wherever you’re listening to podcasts.

Julia: Thanks for tuning in y’all.

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